Upgraded T04 turbos for less $ than stock! Wtf? Link inside
- Thread starter Mightbaal
- Start date
How many turbos have you seen? They're the same. Nothing unique other than you buy with exhaust manifold.
I'm pretty sure he was not speaking about turbos but about the general Honda vs BMW as a whole, and the respective owners and what they are used to dealing with (I believe that was the thread sub-topic at the point of poster's response.)
Filippo
We're comparing BMW to Hondas now... Great
Was that directed at my comment? I couldn't find or missed any references to Hondas, so I'm guessing you though I was referring to a Honda LS motor, and not the ubiquitous Chevrolet LS motor which many people have run into the 8s and 9s with $200 turbos.
I've rebuild quite a few turbos. And although I agree the design is mostly the same the internal components aren't all created equally.
Not sure why anyone would want to put a $200 Chinese turbo on a $5, 000 engine anyway but OK.
600 whp would be more than enough for my goals, that’s pretty impressive considering the costs..what’s your fuel setup?
Nah bro, every LS car at the track is a low-mile, fully built, forged internals, bore & stroked, ported heads, ported FAST intake, cammed, VVT LS3 or newer engine that runs twin 7670 turbos with a 150 shot. Just like every 2jz at the track is a 1200whp car on stock turbos with only intake and exhaust, just cuz'a that closed deck and PI bruh.
The reality of it is, for every fancy high-end engine build theres 200 people just making shit work on a budget. People like to say that any N54 car is the new Civic because of new people on the platform looking for the best bang:buck and doing some DIY or other cost saving. If anything, I'd venture to say theres more teen-Honda-like "junkyard" LS builds than any other capable tuner engine these days.
The N54 is stupid easy to double your HP with boltons and tune so yes theres some questionable routes people are taking nowadays with them, but for the most part the N54 is still relatively "underground" as a track weapon and most of the older 35i's maintain their sleeper status considering a two-gen, decade old BMW has just as much or typically even more performance potential than 90% of sporty cars that have come out in recent years while still lacking some fundamentals for a good chunk of racing. We *just* got an openly available surge tank option, an upgraded fuel pump control module, and standalone options. We're still waiting on readily available + easy options for upgraded trans/drivetrain setups, a pre-built (or really any dedicated components for one) drag suspension setup (although I know at least one company is working on this!), more high pressure/injector flow options, etc. And as far as I know theres only one mass production drift setup that's been made. The N54 is in its teenage stages still compared to the engines and platforms it can compete against - definitely not the new Civic or an outdated platform just yet.
Also because not everyone is a brand name nut hugger. Precision this, Tial that. I've seen some high dollar builds with all name brand parts still underperform. When you buy a brand name, you are paying not only for their "super duper enhanced quality" but also for their marketing team, and it's been estimated that 50% of a products cost is marketing/advertising.
My official China TD04 16T eBay turbos
How much experience do you have with no name chinese turbos outside of the N54 platform? Yes, there is increased level of effort with these, but I'm not sure I see the failure rates in that environment that is presented here. Perhaps it's a PR thing - we run high PRs on small CHRAs and most of...
bmw.spoolstreet.com
Really depends on the product & industry, the company I work for manufacturers capital equipment and spends next to nothing of marketing, under 3% of our revenue if that. We would be considered Brand Name, Tier 1. That being said I am sure some things are 50% marketing...like red bull. Holy F they must just piss away $$$ left and right.
I pay brand name for something I will use often and have to fix less because my free time is worth A LOT. Harbor freight is a great example, going to use the tool once or twice the HF will likely work fine, every day for construction, buy the Ryobi for $200.
If you want to cheap out on your turbos go for it, like in most things, you get what you pay for.
In the industry you are in, would a generic, chinese 'version' of the product be priced dramatically lower, to the tune of 3X less? If so, is it simply a matter of US vs foreign manufacturing? US labor will always cost tremendously more than overseas, and I'm not convinced that we 'Muricans' are that much better at manufacturing. Typically in US manufacturing, since the cost is so much higher, there would be better QC, as it becomes a LOT of wasted labor if it has to be redone. Look at BorgWarner - their turbos are made in China and they are about 3 times as much as a no-name choo choo boi turbo, and they are some of the most affordable.
No, the Chinese equivalents are around 20-30% less expensive than the US made BAA compliant stuff.
Rob@RBTurbo
Lieutenant
Been a solid year now since thread intro, starting to get up there (for those who may have installed around this time)! Still going strong with no reported failures in the all encompassing whatsapp group?
Rob
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I can vouch for the Pair of Ones that I purchased from Rob a few months back as he provides any pertinent specs and details regarding his method of balancing.
Thanks again for the ones rob! currently @455 whp on e25
Hi Rob
My turbos are spot on, I've cracked a ring land in my engine so am doing a fully forged rebuild. No failing of the turbos though, aside from running huge boost on not much octane.
Feel free to join the group.
Has anyone bothered getting a set of these and then sending them out for balancing?
I used to do that with dirt cheap ebay large frame turbos back in the day and it would extend the life 10 fold on even the cheapest ebay offerings.
I used to do that with dirt cheap ebay large frame turbos back in the day and it would extend the life 10 fold on even the cheapest ebay offerings.
Rob@RBTurbo
Lieutenant
Yeah, we see several cases of popped N54 engines a year ourselves and it is always a bummer getting tangled up in those scenarios.
So prior to the engine fail, what did you have on them about 9-10K miles over 10 or so months? Would've been interesting to see how much further they would've taken you with a solid engine. Plans to buy another set and give another go round, or is there some rebuild planning going on? FWIW would not recommend running them as is, but you can give it a whirl if you don't mind taking the chance.
Reason I bumped the thread is we were sent a picture of one that popped off an entire compressor housings the other day, but no one seems to want to mention anything about these things online anymore for whatever reasons.
Thanks,
Rob
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