Yeah socialism! How is it Rob's fault you live in a country that taxes you to death? I bet you will be blown away to know that your Nikes cost way more there than they do here too! That Phil Knight is a real asshole....
Upgraded T04 turbos for less $ than stock! Wtf? Link inside
- Thread starter Mightbaal
- Start date
Yeah socialism! How is it Rob's fault you live in a country that taxes you to death? I bet you will be blown away to know that your Nikes cost way more there than they do here too! That Phil Knight is a real asshole....
Rob@RBTurbo
Lieutenant
Think you may have the junk pipes mixed up w another vendor, as we DO get those emails a lot from competitors customers. Honestly in this platform if there is ANY shortcoming there WILL ALWAYS be emails, so indeed it is VERY mind bending how the guy who we never even dealt with has all the “accurate real world” info whereas we’ve heard no such feedback? Come to think about it, that is usually the internet for you... the one with no actual firsthand experience doing the talking.
Don't understand we're all this cross contamination came from, the op was running other hybrids, curious as to see how thes run. No matter were there made, it's how there able to hope up under demand. I'm sure others are not building there turbos with 100% American parts, when there all made overseas to begin with!
Congrats thanks for taking one for the team. What are your impressions so far? Please keep us posted on any issues. Any additional feedback on the quality? Any issues with waste gate rattle? What did you do about gaskets and the copper block bolts?
I'm typically skeptical about buying from China but if others vendors are sourcing the same exact kits it sounds like a very liable alternative for the budget minded?
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Rob@RBTurbo
Lieutenant
If you are on any form of social media (ie. Instagram/FB Groups), you'd see those vendors who "source the exact same kits" are having tons of posts made such as "my xxx turbos have failed in under 3k miles, don't buy!" regularly. It literally is to the point we are considering making some fails collage or perhaps a 2019 fails calendar, and this is based on those who simply email these things to us (surely we are not getting them all). In short just because one (or two) vendors source and resell a sub par kit doesn't make any of it "liable", only makes one that is cheaper than the other due to lack of markup. But if inconsistency/risk in quality is what you are looking for in considering those options, then going to the cheaper route makes the most sense for sure.
Rob
Hey Rob,
Dot get me wrong if anyone has good turbo's for this platform it's your company. You have made it abundantly clear that you guys have your VSR machine and ensure your turbo's are properly balanced to ensure durability, longevity, and top notch performance. But I'm really looking to hear from those on the forum that have used and installed these turbo's as a cheaper alternative. I'm not looking to set any track records and I only drive the car on the weekends. For me all your doing is lodging a smear campaign as these are in direct competition to what your selling. So it appears your feedback is not as credible because there is a definite conflict of interest.
It would be great to know what percentage has failed compared to what's been actually installed and running. These have been on the market now for quite some time. Unfortunately we typically only hear about the bad ones. If it's one percent of thousands than that's probably very acceptable.
Personally if were in the market for a pair of $800 turbo's then were probably not even a potential customer of yours as your turbo's are considerably more expensive. It's too bad we cant just focus on the folks that have purchased these and share their experience with the pro's and con's for those of us that dont really want to go out and buy $3K-4K on a kit.
Rob@RBTurbo
Lieutenant
We do not consider these direct competition with our products at all. These are for the demographic who like buying cheap throwaway junk turbos, and it should be made abundantly clear that selling cheap throwaway junk turbos is not part of our business model. Some other vendors may be ok with it and if that is their thing that is great, but some consumers out there may want to know what they are getting into with it all.
All we are doing is handing you the information you are looking for in advance on a silver platter. Nothing about smear campaigns, it is about facts/knowledge/experience gained over about 15 years of building turbos and seeing the same old stuff again and again. As usual it is dismissed by some folks and that is ok, honestly it has become part of the fun when we get to see it as we called it and laugh about it along the way (month after month, year after year).
Rob
It's not just that these can fail but in the end can cost just as much if you had chosen to buy from someone who builds better turbos. It's simple math and the end decision really depends on how you install these.
If you install your turbos (assuming China honors warranty)
$800 for turbos, + $200 install kit = $1k
1 failure = $1200
2 failures = $1400
If you pay someone
China turbos $800 + install $200 + labor $1500 = $2500
1 failure = $4200
2 failures = $5900
Good known turbos (with low failure rates)
$3k + 1.5k install + install kit = $4700
1 failure $6200
Basically your gambling with your money, your car and your cars downtime. So if this is your daily, id suggest you purchsse turbos that are not China. Then again for a daily you may want to stick to stock. If your paying for labor the gamble odds gets worse with China turbos and your more than likely going to have a failure or two and pay the same amount in the end and still end up with inferior turbos (td03, smaller compressor wheels). Then to make it worse China has been known to avoid warranty claims at all costs and shipping to China means alot more downtime, with risks of shipping damage.
Buy what ever you want, it's your money spend it anyway you want because no one will stop you, but just remember you may end up paying the same or more depending on how many failures you have. If your doing the labor yourself then the gamble seems to really pay off in savings, but only when you do your own labor (China might not even honor the warranty if you do that, i'd definitly ask them first)
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Rob@RBTurbo
Lieutenant
It is worth noting we actually have a similar product to these in this thread, from a TD03 centersection and wheel size perspective alone (nothing about our builds are outsourced, we use authentic OE castings, robust bearings, high end wastegates, etc). They are $1,999 MSRP but however are in beta at this moment (6 sets shipped starting 10/2017 with 0% failure rate to date).
One more thing we are seeing literally a 0% failure rate on our turbo products over the past couple years. More specifically on our entire portfolio of N54 Turbo products shipped since 1/1/17 we have seen literally only 1 unit come back (which was a customer error) all with non-stop shipping of product and hundreds of units installed. So it is fairly safe to say that if as a vendor you are hearing of issues once a week, month, or even 6 months (on new shipments); you are very likely doing something wrong. Either that are you dealt a VERY horrible hand with customers or install techs. In short and as a consumer being a "part of" a "failure rate" should be close to being struck by lightning on a quality built product purchase.
Rob
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What about this option
If you install your turbos your self(assuming China honors warranty) one time.
$800 for turbos, + $200 install kit = $1k
installation cost= a couple of weekends and some bloody knuckles.
0 failure = $0
LPFP Stage 2 $275 E50mix
Dyno $50
Put down 550 to the wheel go hunt down some vett's and GT's and be happy.
Is this a pipe dream?
It's your money, your man hours and your downtime your gambling with. Do as you wish and report back and let us know how it's going.
From my experience over the last 30 years products/electronics used to last a long time; however, ever since China took over production everything has become crap, and costs more to repair than replace so they become throw aways. This is chinas business model and its how they make so much money. Turbos have to be precise, were talking about propellers spinning over 100k rpms. Any screw up here and kaboom. Feel free to buy a set and create a build thread and report back for as long as you own them.
Rob@RBTurbo
Lieutenant
Judging by the VSR traces we saw alone (when we purchased an OE set from this same manufacturer) it is a crap shoot. Some may work and some may not, so it is an inconsistency thing in that sole regard then on top of junk metals and sloppy wastegates. Sounds like it is your cup of tea though, now pray you are the lucky one and go get them and report back after some time in use.
Rob
Actually I think this is misinformation at best. These Chinese turbos are known to be lottery ticket purchases. Hell, people whine about buying known vendor twins and being concerned about longevity. Furthermore, $800 turbos are not competition to $2,000 turbos.
I also find dismissing a vendor's feedback and "not credible" is specious at best. Let's see ... he's an expert in the business, having thousands of hours over many years, with hundreds and hundreds of turbos having gone through his hands. And so your expertise to judge credibility is ..... Please share!
I don't know Rob from Adam. I own one small product from his company - RB Turbo PCV. But I wouldn't question the credibility of his observations. Now questioning his observations is different; but not his credibility.
Filippo
Not willing to spend the extra time for a turbo swap on an awd is just pure lazy. I own both an awd and rwd 335i convertible and I love my awd more. It's not only faster but it never has traction problems and it feels so much safer in the rain (especially in fl) I wished my e93 was awd, but they never made those. You have a rare car, if you dont want awd, sell it and buy rwd then update the turbos and become annoyed that you need drag radials for traction. Awd cars also have another benefit, cheaper smaller tires that can be rotated front to back from a square setup instead of buying a staggered setup (I run this on my e93).
AWD cars also eat the front drivetrain components for breakfast if you're pushing any real power. No thanks
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