Final Review of Propulsive Dynamics Upgraded Transmission - Very Good Unit.

[Rob09msport]

No I mean when slowing and it goes back to first like once warmed up and you coast to stop with light brake. Stage 3 should alter the pd values no prob imagine it's like pd cal is a hardware overclock in bios and xhp like a software overclock. Pd Is the default values by zf then xhp modifies them but they are not multiplicative or additive in a sense that pd adds line pressure xhp sets more it's like pd sets to 10 then xhp sets to 10 so value is 10. I do believe pd is prob more robust but that's where adaptation comes in. I bet your car adapts alot faster than mine after a reset since your trans is calibrated on a dyno mine was not. That's pure speculation on that part. I get worried that the resets aren't good that's why wasnt sure if I should do again since hardware stayed the same and then wasnt sure if was healthier for trans to adapt on stock so less line pressure etc and theoretically less chance for damage.

 

[matreyia]

No I mean when slowing and it goes back to first like once warmed up and you coast to stop with light brake. Stage 3 should alter the pd values no prob imagine it's like pd cal is a hardware overclock in bios and xhp like a software overclock. Pd Is the default values by zf then xhp modifies them but they are not multiplicative or additive in a sense that pd adds line pressure xhp sets more it's like pd sets to 10 then xhp sets to 10 so value is 10. I do believe pd is prob more robust but that's where adaptation comes in. I bet your car adapts alot faster than mine after a reset since your trans is calibrated on a dyno mine was not. That's pure speculation on that part. I get worried that the resets aren't good that's why wasnt sure if I should do again since hardware stayed the same and then wasnt sure if was healthier for trans to adapt on stock so less line pressure etc and theoretically less chance for damage.

You should adapt on whatever calibration you plan to use. Otherwise, if you adapt on stock and reflash to stage 3, you will have to adapt again regardless. So 2x adaptation work... no thank you.
Even if you don't do an adaptation drive after stage 3 flash, the transmission will do it over time anyways. So if you are going to adapt...then flash the desired stage and adapt. Waste of time adapting on stock then reflashing.

I would not worry about the downshift anomaly right now. Because it will take a few weeks of driving to smooth it out. Just try to repeat the situation over and over so the trans can adjust.

 

[Rob09msport]

Just heads up Jason at pd responded and said do the relearn on stock flash then switch to stage 3. I'm thinking my trans may be low on fluid cause maybe were air pockets since mine was empty not flushed so im gonna check

 

[matreyia]

Just heads up Jason at pd responded and said do the relearn on stock flash then switch to stage 3. I'm thinking my trans may be low on fluid cause maybe were air pockets since mine was empty not flushed so im gonna check

Good to know!

 

[Rob09msport]

I think should take your videos and a little guide with links to fill and relearn procedure and make a few thread for the pd trans and stock to honestly cause their us so much scattered info with misinformation mixed and not many good short videos showing zip kit etc and what to look for

 

[matreyia]

I think should take your videos and a little guide with links to fill and relearn procedure and make a few thread for the pd trans and stock to honestly cause their us so much scattered info with misinformation mixed and not many good short videos showing zip kit etc and what to look for

I don't have proper instructional videos. I only have bits and pieces of my journey. ZF has the fill procedure on youtube and there are copies of adaptation procedures scattered in a couple of places.

 

[Rob09msport]

That's my point scattered in want to try to organize it

 

[Blackarrow335i]

I just finished my PD clutch install, it says flash stock do the relearn process flash xhp follow their directions and you should be good transmission will shift a little harsh for the first few miles but should go away pretty soon my transmission shifts butter smooth! I also slowly broke it in before wot!

 

[Rob09msport]

I just finished my PD clutch install, it says flash stock do the relearn process flash xhp follow their directions and you should be good transmission will shift a little harsh for the first few miles but should go away pretty soon my transmission shifts butter smooth! I also slowly broke it in before wot!

Do you have any clunk into 1st when slowing to stop aggressively. Like if driving fast and rolling a stop sign. It almost feels like all the clutches grab together I wonder if it's a downside to not doing the install with eurotrans recalibrating. It doesnt do it for first day or two after flush cause I dumped fluid and changed filter twice since I had a diff issue which is now perfect except for that. Just figured I would get someone else's feedback

 

[matreyia]

Do you have any clunk into 1st when slowing to stop aggressively. Like if driving fast and rolling a stop sign. It almost feels like all the clutches grab together I wonder if it's a downside to not doing the install with eurotrans recalibrating. It doesnt do it for first day or two after flush cause I dumped fluid and changed filter twice since I had a diff issue which is now perfect except for that. Just figured I would get someone else's feedback

How long has this clunk to first been going on. After a couple of weeks or daily mixed driving, it should have subsided substantially. As I recall, when I first got the PD unit from Eurotrans...it was virtually indistinguishable from stock operation. Invisible shifting smooth and solid. It was only after all that planetary gear shit and torque converter, valve body episode that it went apart and has not been the same ever since. Regardless, the unit as rough as it is...performs to my satisfaction.

 

[Rob09msport]

I can drive around it I have less than hundred miles since last assembly and it is like it drops in to first to aggressively. I figured you prob dont have cause you had yours tuned on dyno by eurotrans

 

[matreyia]

I can drive around it I have less than hundred miles since last assembly and it is like it drops in to first to aggressively. I figured you prob dont have cause you had yours tuned on dyno by eurotrans

No, my unit did the same thing when using xHP stage 3. Over time, it subsided...but again, it will never be as smooth as stock PD flash. The only reason to use xHP is the manual shifting speed. And the PD shifts are not as I would like... it holds to long on some gears and I want it to shift sooner. So MPG is less with stock PD shifting I think.

 

[Blackarrow335i]

Do you have any clunk into 1st when slowing to stop aggressively. Like if driving fast and rolling a stop sign. It almost feels like all the clutches grab together I wonder if it's a downside to not doing the install with eurotrans recalibrating. It doesnt do it for first day or two after flush cause I dumped fluid and changed filter twice since I had a diff issue which is now perfect except for that. Just figured I would get someone else's feedback

Yes I did for the first 100-200 miles but it went away! I did the install myself! Supposedly the PD clutches are a drop in kit but that isn’t true!!! Anyway after I finished the install I flashed back to stock did the relearn process (1st gear was clunky at that point) kept driving it on stock flash for another 200 miles (the clunk went away) then flashed xhp did another 200 miles and then started to brake it in before I went wot! Transmission shifts butter smooth all gears! Hope you can get it figured out! Who did the install for you?

 

[Rob09msport]

"The shop" in Stratford CT they have great rep and build alot of 1500hp gtrs and 1000 plus subarus , porsches, Audi's, and have done alot of pure turbo bmw builds and singles. This was first pd kit but have rebuilt plenty stock ones.
Btw what about kit wasnt drop in ? Im curious so I can ask how they dealt with it.

 

[Blackarrow335i]

"The shop" in Stratford CT they have great rep and build alot of 1500hp gtrs and 1000 plus subarus , porsches, Audi's, and have done alot of pure turbo bmw builds and singles. This was first pd kit but have rebuilt plenty stock ones.
Btw what about kit wasnt drop in ? Im curious so I can ask how they dealt with it.

Well you have to stay in ZF specs or the entire transmission won’t work, ZF and PD clutches are different heights! You will have more discs with the PD kit but they are thinner steal discs as oem that’s why you will have more but those kits are designed for all 6hp variants so you have to know the ZF specs so you can stack the clutch packs accordingly! Also clutch packs need to be compressed to a certain amount of NM then measure to achieve the correct height! ITS NOT A DROP IN KIT!!!

 

[Rob09msport]

Do you have to machine steels down ? To get to spec . Im confused by stack accordingly

 

[Blackarrow335i]

Do you have to machine steels down ? To get to spec . Im confused by stack accordingly

You have to select and order the right snapring size! If you stack them up the same way as the ones you take out then you will be way out of spec either the clutch stacks are to short or to tall since the kit was designed to fit all 6hp variants!

 

[Rob09msport]

What would side effects of this be. I would hope that the tech would caught this but that would be on me as well if I tell him I have a rebuild kit and it isn't same as reg install . Or do all rebuilds require this to be done since their is some variance ?

 

[Blackarrow335i]

What would side effects of this be. I would hope that the tech would caught this but that would be on me as well if I tell him I have a rebuild kit and it isn't same as reg install . Or do all rebuilds require this to be done since their is some variance ?

All rebuilds require to check clearance and verify that you are in specs! And you , well your technician should check with an air compressor that the clutches work properly .

 

[majdeko]

Well folks, here is my final review of the PD Transmission that I bought over a year ago.
Due to my stock transmission going bye bye during tuning by Wedge (not saying that he caused it), I ordered a PD unit.

Initially when it was installed, it ran smoothly like stock. Then, if you have read my other reports about the nightmare that both I and Jason (the owner of PD) went through trying to get warranty work done by Eurotrans in Georgia… you would know that there were some rough periods where I had to send the unit back to Eurotrans because the rear planetary gear set went bad, and also the VB had some worn parts that I replaced with a Sonnax kit…as well as the torque converter. Now you might be tempted to blame this on PD, but it was really Eurotrans’ corruption that caused all these issues. PD did their best to honor the warranty and was in the same spot I was in… dealing with an unresponsive Eurotrans shop.

Anyways, before, during, and after all that foolishness, I was always trying to get the unit to shift properly and smoothly with xHP at any stage…but especially stage 3. And it just never shifted correctly. Symptoms were, lurching, hesitation, jerkiness, and then violent noises when under WOT. No matter what I did the thing just didn’t shift smoothly under WOT.

THE SOLUTION: So, even though all those things were real issues and had to be worked on under warranty, I finally figured out what caused the incorrect shifting behavior the entire time.

It turns out, that the stock EKPM3 controller was not able to supply a stable current to the stage 2 and later on additional stage 3 LPFP. So what ended up happening was the ECU would cut fuel intermittently and that caused the throttle to go apeshit, which confused the TCU and that would cause the shifting anomalies…it was going insane trying to figure out what gear to to into due to the inadequate EKPM3 controller.

So… I recently installed the PM4 Torquebyte LPFP controller configured to run two 450 Wahlbro pumps… and I have been testing xHP in all stages… and now I have been on stage 3xHP for a week now. Shifting has been smooth in normal driving mode even under high power and WOT. Sport mode was problematic for a longer time due to the different shifting parameters and power levels. So… what I did was drive the car in sport mode for the last three days in all situations both conservative and aggressively, AND I also adjusted the torque reduction settings, the max RPM settings… and now the car shifts normally and way smoother than any time in its history with the PD unit.

I want to take this moment to let you know that the Propulsive Dynamics hardware upgrade has not been the issue, the clutches are rock solid, the bushings rock solid… and only that episode with the faulty planetary gear was a problem…that was Eurotrans’ fault for cutting corners…only this was the hiccup.

If Propulsive Dynamics still has any clutch and bushing kits up for sale, I highly recommend you buy one and find a TRUSTWORTHY shop to assembly the upgraded parts. Then just do adaptations reset and the adaptations drive program and then drive for a week on Sport mode and then switch to normal mode and it should be smooth as butter.

I feel bad for Propulsive Dynamics as my problems with the unit were not due to their parts at all but the consequence of a corrupt and arrogant assembly shop in Georgia.
In summary, if you have issues with shifting behavior, whether or not you have an upgraded transmission or stock unit… and you are running stage 2 or stage 3 LPFP setups and you have the stock EKPM2 or 3 controller, you will have to upgrade to the PM4 Torquebyte controller in order to restore consistent fuel pressures to the system so that you TCU doesn’t go insane.

That be all.

Hi Matreyia,
Thank you for the valuable information, just please confirm that the PM4 from Torquebyte is working in your BMW E93? since I have BMW E90-N54, 2007 and I am currently suffering from EKPM2 that I have since I am running stage 2 LPFP, so if the PM4 works perfectly in BMW please let me know..
Thank you...