Stock Turbo Love

[Silver_Sur4r_N54]

I too am staying with stock turbos, running a 470whp tune on 19psi.

I like the stock response and driving characteristics, but really, the reasoning is cost.

Upgraded turbos are expensive and unreliable no matter what, and they're useless without a fuel system (And I won't use PI so it's an expensive shotgun). You're also playing on bad odds with the stock short block. Blah blah blah they're good to 800whp blah blah blah I blew a 51,000 mile motor on stock turbos and a safe tune. So I'd need fuel, a built block, and then suspension work. This car is down right terrifying in 3rd gear with the way it wanders. And having driven one with over 100k and similar power, it was suicidal. So that's more cost, and it takes away from the comfort of the car. So now we've spent 15 grand and have 750whp, how are we going to stop? I was fading the IS brakes (Which have ducts) in less than a lap of a 2:09/lap track. Bill out another few thousand.

Where does it stop? And what are we left with? #racecar is cool and all, but that's not why I bought a luxury sports car. Especially when I could get a stock ZL1 for cheaper that'd destroy every street legal 3 series on this forum.

So I'll stick with stockers, and, as much shit as I talk, probably go with Rob's turbos when mine give out.

what setup are you running that got you to 470whp? I'm stage 1 and in my opinion thats to much power for stock suspension. I've done more mods to my suspension than the engine. You definitely should look into rear subframe bushings and good upgraded control arms to help with the wandering. As for upgraded turbos, you are right on them being expensive. But if I had the money I'd go RB first Pure as a close second.

 

[Aaron]

Safe as a tune can be with 19psi, it's not a total record breaking kill tune.

All the bolt ons, and an LSD.

After I get it back together I plan on spending some money on the suspension, just don't want to go too far with it.

 

[SlowE93]

yyeeahh... no. Gotta see that before i believe it. Either way i can't imagine that that is lasting power on the stockers.

What kind of WGDC percentage is everyone running thier stockers at? I am going over 60% to target 18psi and i'm wondering if i should be in lower numbers. I like the way the car runs. Right now i'm just wondering how to keep it in one piece. Limiting wastegate closure to make it as easy on the turbo's as possible.
Stock in/outlets and i'm wondering if my 2.25 (or2.5inch) lower charge pipe is a bottleneck. How can i make the stockers make boost with low wgdc?

https://datazap.me/u/ballistic/bmw-...ic-flexfuel-high-e-content?log=0&data=3-22-30

I made 470/490 on stock turbos.....but not at 19 psi

 

[iminhell1]

For myself, I can't justify upgraded twins because I don't see enough short run gain to justify the cost. Right now I'm consistent 11.6"s and have run faster (more favorable DA). I don't want to but it's honestly FAR cheaper to play the weight game and wheel game than to do the upgraded turbo game. And like everyone else, I need more fuel if I go upgraded turbos. So that's a Double Barrel on top.
And realistically with 128,000 on the clock I don't feel the bearings will like being stressed even harder. Something will let go. I don't have those type of funds, I don't want to have those type of funds. If I want faster it's better to just buy a faster car. I've got over the ego with cars long ago. I don't do it for any reason other than this car was in my price range, it's really comfortable, it's fun, it's quick and it has been reliable for me.

My personal goal for the car is making it a good car at everything; drag, roll, cones, hpde and DD. I have suspension and wheel/tire left to do. And some parts here to fix some of the shortcomings ... front M arms, solid diff bushings, solid subframe bushings ....

 

[chrisdfv]

yyeeahh... no. Gotta see that before i believe it. Either way i can't imagine that that is lasting power on the stockers.

What kind of WGDC percentage is everyone running thier stockers at? I am going over 60% to target 18psi and i'm wondering if i should be in lower numbers. I like the way the car runs. Right now i'm just wondering how to keep it in one piece. Limiting wastegate closure to make it as easy on the turbo's as possible.
Stock in/outlets and i'm wondering if my 2.25 (or2.5inch) lower charge pipe is a bottleneck. How can i make the stockers make boost with low wgdc?

https://datazap.me/u/ballistic/bmw-...ic-flexfuel-high-e-content?log=0&data=3-22-30

When I was on stockers, I was running close to 80% wgdc up top (about 18psi @ 6K RPM). I ran it this way for years. After market inlets and outlets lower wgdc a considerable amount.

 

[Silver_Sur4r_N54]

When I was on stockers, I was running close to 80% wgdc up top (about 18psi @ 6K RPM). I ran it this way for years. After market inlets and outlets lower wgdc a considerable amount.

2 years before they eventually gave up? How much horse do you think you were running?

 

[Silver_Sur4r_N54]

I got a question for everybody... Aftermarket PVC system... is it really needed if we still have to walnut blast? I always thought I needed to do this upgrade but It seems it just prolongs the cleaning for just a short while. Whats the consensus on this?

 

[iminhell1]

I got a question for everybody... Aftermarket PVC system... is it really needed if we still have to walnut blast? I always thought I needed to do this upgrade but It seems it just prolongs the cleaning for just a short while. Whats the consensus on this?

I'm just on RB PCV and catch can on the flapper side. No problems I know of.

 

[Silver_Sur4r_N54]

I'm just on RB PCV and catch can on the flapper side. No problems I know of.

Not really questioning if there are any problems. More so if they are really needed?

 

[chrisdfv]

2 years before they eventually gave up? How much horse do you think you were running?

They never stopped making boost, but they were smoking terribly on decel. They also had 140K miles.

 

[chrisdfv]

How much horse do you think you were running?

Forgot to answer, but on E50 i was making 445whp/475wtq about 21 psi at 4k rpm.

 

[E92-Ghandi]

I got a question for everybody... Aftermarket PVC system... is it really needed if we still have to walnut blast? I always thought I needed to do this upgrade but It seems it just prolongs the cleaning for just a short while. Whats the consensus on this?

I have BMS on the high side and RB valve, car was smoking from time to time, a bit embarrassing and annoying to be honest, went with external PCV and an extra oil catch can and no more smoke, barely once in a month or so.
That's the only reason i went that route, THE SOMKE!

 

[fmorelli]

Did you plug the head? All that soot building up in the intake runners is likely the worst maintenance issue with the N54 design.

Filippo

 

[E92-Ghandi]

Did you plug the head? All that soot building up in the intake runners is likely the worst maintenance issue with the N54 design.

Filippo

Not yet, i'm planning to do that soon, once i have time to clean the valves.
Couldn't agree more, it is the worst maintenance.

 

[Silver_Sur4r_N54]

I have BMS on the high side and RB valve, car was smoking from time to time, a bit embarrassing and annoying to be honest, went with external PCV and an extra oil catch can and no more smoke, barely once in a month or so.
That's the only reason i went that route, THE SOMKE!

To me that sounds like it is masking a problem. Not fixing it. Basically my question is what is the point of an aftermarket PVC and Catch can if you still have to Walnut Blast regardless? Does the aftermarket PVC help with boost ( obviously it will help with boost if the stock PVC is leaking) on a healthy N54?

 

[Silver_Sur4r_N54]

Forgot to answer, but on E50 i was making 445whp/475wtq about 21 psi at 4k rpm.

Those are Pretty good numbers! Now if only I could get close to that power with only 93 octane and stock snails.

 

[Deleted member 2204]

I think it's a calculation you need to do for yourself. Any kind of solution (catchcan etc) never fully solved the problem. It is however very expensive and brings extra complexity to the system.

I decided that i will probably to have the valved cleaned only once or twice in the lifetime of the car (while its in my possesion anyway). The cost of the catchcan(s) vs 2 wallnut blasts is minimal so i decided to spend it on the blasts (or buy the kit to do it myself)

 

[fmorelli]

Actually I'm going to go out on a limb and say I don't know that your logic works (which is grounded in a cost-centric comparison). I see people all over the forums chasing misfires, timing corrections, threads all over the place on cylinder #5 etc. At only 30k miles on my motor, healthy, highly well maintained, etc ... my runners look like shit. I've had tuning issues also (with index 12s, 1 step colder plugs, stockers running 18psi, everything fresh aside intake runners). Not sure yet if this will clear it up but if you've done any reading on flow bench, rates, et cetera, I'm sure you know that a stalactite-infested cavern is not ideal for airflow. The problem is not doing walnut blasts - simply I doubt you are going to do them, say, every 20k miles (based on my experience). To do it right, you have to clean it BEFORE it becomes a problem, right? It would be nice to minimize the issue or even eliminate it. Why? I think it is one of the unattributable gremlins that plagues this car, from timing corrections to busted ring lands. It's just my 02 cents. For anyone making power, I can't see any rational that all that crap packed in certain intake runners is healthy for tuning for power...

Filippo

 

[Silver_Sur4r_N54]

I think it's a calculation you need to do for yourself. Any kind of solution (catchcan etc) never fully solved the problem. It is however very expensive and brings extra complexity to the system.

I decided that i will probably to have the valved cleaned only once or twice in the lifetime of the car (while its in my possesion anyway). The cost of the catchcan(s) vs 2 wallnut blasts is minimal so i decided to spend it on the blasts (or buy the kit to do it myself)

I felt the same way for the past 3 years. I haven't really seen a reason to go with a catch can or PVC after seeing my friend with it and still having to do walnut cleaning. I just came to the conclusion that walnut blast is a maintenance issue just like plugs or oil changes. Every 2 years or so I think is decent.

 

[fmorelli]

I felt the same way for the past 3 years. I haven't really seen a reason to go with a catch can or PVC after seeing my friend with it and still having to do walnut cleaning. I just came to the conclusion that walnut blast is a maintenance issue just like plugs or oil changes. Every 2 years or so I think is decent.

When you say catch can, are you talking low-side external PCV, head runners for PCV plugged, as well as a high side catch can setup? In other words, the complete system externalized as the head ports plugged? Just curious ...

I know this subject has been beat to death in places ... yeah I'm late to that party.

Filippo