CSF Radiator Long Term Review
- Thread starter matreyia
- Start date
Hence why I’m asking. Would be a serious oops to put an insulating coating on something that’s supposed to shed heat. Swaintech makes some coatings for aiding in heat rejection/removal.
screaminfast
Sergeant
screaminfast
Sergeant
Ceramic coats should not be used on exteriors of radiators or intercoolers. As I understand, they are used to minimize heat from soaking into the bay and that means they keep the heat inside the units. Which means that you need to leave the units uncoated to allow maximum heat transfer from the radiator or intercooler to the outside. The heat should not be kept inside the intercooler or radiator. The metal acts as a heatsink to radiate the heat out of the units.
You use such coats only in case you have a hot pipe or turbo that needs to reduce the heat radiating into the bay which causes the air intake temps to rise. If you coat the intercooler or radiator, it will raise the air intake temperature in theory.
screaminfast
Sergeant
Click the link above. It’s a specialized coating to enhance thermal transfer. I have their standard ceramic coatings on my inlets, turbine housings, downpipes and intake manifold. Might do chargepipe too.
According to the product tech sheet this coating is really design for protecting high temperature surfaces such as exhaust pipes. It doesn’t say anything about improving heat transfer. Just protects the hot surfaces from discoloring.
This kind of makes sense. I went to the Materials Safety Data Sheets where it provides general composition information. It looks like the coatings are a mixture of some pretty nasty solvents, high temp polymer binders, and ceramic and metallic particles. I’ve been working with these kind of materials for >25 years and the coating will certainly dissipate heat, and the coating surface roughness may help a little in that regard, possibly better for radiative modes of heat transfer. Not sure whether it improves convective heat dissipation of 80F air flowing over a 220F aluminum radiator, however. I’d like to see the test results to be sure.
COMPOSITION/INFORMATION OF INGREDIENTS
0-10% Titanium dioxide
0-2% Carbon black
20-50% Ambient Temperature-curable refractory resin(s)
15-30% Ceramic and/or metallic pigments and colorants
0-1% Silicone-based rheology modifiers
20-65% p-chlorobenzotrifluoride
This kind of makes sense. I went to the Materials Safety Data Sheets where it provides general composition information. It looks like the coatings are a mixture of some pretty nasty solvents, high temp polymer binders, and ceramic and metallic particles. I’ve been working with these kind of materials for >25 years and the coating will certainly dissipate heat, and the coating surface roughness may help a little in that regard, possibly better for radiative modes of heat transfer. Not sure whether it improves convective heat dissipation of 80F air flowing over a 220F aluminum radiator, however. I’d like to see the test results to be sure.
COMPOSITION/INFORMATION OF INGREDIENTS
0-10% Titanium dioxide
0-2% Carbon black
20-50% Ambient Temperature-curable refractory resin(s)
15-30% Ceramic and/or metallic pigments and colorants
0-1% Silicone-based rheology modifiers
20-65% p-chlorobenzotrifluoride
screaminfast
Sergeant
For sure. I think the generalization about high temp is for all the of C-type coatings. They offer it for everything like piston coatings, exhaust piping, electrical barriers etc. They group them under air cure vs oven cure I think. We'll see how it holds up. I need to get into MHD and see if I can set the pump cycle more aggressive with my back end flash.
in terms of thermal conductivity, it doesn't get much better than bare aluminum. putting any sort of coating on it to improve the heat transfer is a lost game.
screaminfast
Sergeant
Nanocoatings to improve thermal transfer on bare metal have been around for quite some time...
Nanocoating Boosts Heat Transfer
Nanocoating Boosts Heat Transfer -- Treated surfaces significantly outperform bare metal.
Nanocoatings to improve thermal transfer on bare metal have been around for quite some time...
Nanocoating Boosts Heat Transfer
Nanocoating Boosts Heat Transfer -- Treated surfaces significantly outperform bare metal.www.chemicalprocessing.com
Yes, such materials are common found in semiconductor industry. But they are not used in automotive/Motorsport due to cost.
Previous poster already dug up the MSDS of your coating. It is consisted of ceramic and resin, all which are heat insulating material.
Look we are just trying to save you some bucks and headaches...
This. For a convective heat dissipation application it seems like a test to demonstrate the benefit would be elementary part and parcel for the manufacturer that sells such a coating and claims that improvement at as its primary value. smh
Coatings - various surf against, ceramic barrier, and lubricity - have been around for a long time, first in aerospace but in automotive racing since the mid-eighties, at least as I remember. We were extensively working with Swain technologies back in the late 80s and early 90s with our IMSA and endurance racing applications.
Filippo
screaminfast
Sergeant
Yes as I replied above the MSDS for cerekote includes their entire line of products which range from heat protection to the specialty coatings. The thermal transfer coating has a specialized application method different from the other coatings. The coating didn’t cost me anything, we are partnered with a coater since we do it in the firearms industry.
SwainTech is the shit. Been using them forever. Also helps that they are literally 15 minutes down the road.
Copper would be better for thermal properties, but not for the wallet.
Can you do me a favor and tell Swaintech they have the worst customer service ever. Ive tried to get them to give me a rough cost on having some stuff coated several times and they just send a generic copy/paste response every time. Their products are top notch though.
screaminfast
Sergeant
I used to have a direct line to the owner, because they sponsored my Subaru back in the day. What are you having coated?
I’d like to have my motiv manifold, downpipe, and turbine housing coated with the white lightning TBC.
screaminfast
Sergeant
Just called over there and talked to Mike. He said ~$375 manifold, ~$125 for turbine, and downpipe is about $40 per foot. They're running 4 weeks turnaround right now.
The other options is I can have my cerekote guy do it with the high temp coating if you were interested in that. It would be much less, especially since I'm having him coat my exhaust to the axleback.
Thanks man! I currently have it coated with cerekote, but wanted to switch it up. That sounds right in line with where I thought the price would be. I’ll have to reach out to them via phone to get it sent in to them. Appreciate it.
I am assuming you are coating cerekote on your exhaust to keep in heat from bleeding onto the underside of the car... if you use the same coating on your radiator or intercooler...that would keep the heat inside those units and increase IAT temperature...? Or are you saying he is coating exhaust with cerekote and intercooler, radiator with a coating opposite of cerekote properties...namely heat radiating coating for intercool and radiator.
screaminfast
Sergeant
Cerekote is the brand name. They have both heat insulating and thermal transfer enhancing coatings amongst other products as well.
