RB GF 19T Cast Turbo Review and Results

[V8bait]

LOL, those cats have it good!

Loving your approach to OEM+ look. I am a huge fan of 'sleepers' as these cars are relatively common but most do not rip up the asphalt when the boost kicks in. I used to have goals for OEM+ with my MKIV GTI; there were so many Audi offerings (and R32) that really spruced up the car. It feels like BMW has plenty of those upgrades as well.


Holy shit that video of inside the car. That thing RIPS.

Exhaust sounds fantastic, I do hear the rasp in the first video... but I have similar sounds with my 335is exhaust and catless DPs...



Regarding specifics about the turbos... hmm. I am mostly interested in how the day to day feels with them. I've been bothering Rob with a million emails about impacts on daily driving specifically with how quick boost builds. My 104k+ stock turbos are a little lethargic and I don't know how to compare with any offerings. I don't want to downgrade from current responsiveness.

Is there a way to get a 'feel for responsiveness' through logs? I have a few logs from last weekend, including:

Log-08-27-2020-02-15-40

Uploaded by API.

bmw.spoolstreet.com

I personally am not looking to drag my car, but I have been impressed with the slips you posted. Getting into big turbo territory! What goes through my head is 'what is the day to day like with turbos targeting so much power?'


I get brought back down to earth with my 'instant spool' expectations after reading:




Other than spool speed and feel on day to day, do you have anything else to share? It seems like you document thoroughly!

You'd be surprised how responsive most twins are down low. Spool to 600whp+ shouldn't be what you're looking at, twins generally have really good time to torque and even down low are going to be pushing positive airflow over singles and making 300-400+ torque. When most people replace their tired twins they generally pick up power nearly everywhere, especially up top. Only notable exceptions are the really large twin setups, and people who actually had properly functioning turbos before the upgrade (rare).

 

[langsbr]

China now does 19T turbos for about $1200!
I had GCs before. Now with everyone's success of the China 17Ts I've gone for the Wuhan wind mills...

Totally not comparable to the RB GFs in any way other than they both use a 19T compressor wheel. The Turbine housing, manifold, and even compressor housing are all different and the RB GFs are MUCH more optimal for high boost. I would wager that Rob is one of, if not the only vendor that does his own VSR balancing, which the china boi turbos most likely aren't balanced at all.

 

[Asbjorn]

Other than spool speed and feel on day to day, do you have anything else to share? It seems like you document thoroughly!

Hmm here's a video from yesterday at a track. A hotlap done in 35C humid heat. 18psi. Distorted sound though.

 

[RNM]

I have RBs GF 17t on my daily driver and it is an absolute blast to drive on full e85 even in this hot South Carolina weather.

I can't wait to see how she pulls in the winter.

 

[b4llistic]

EDIT: Thanks your finding and reading my post. Unfortunately, Spoolstreet is no longer a neutral platform where we can have honest discussions on subjects and products freely.
For this reason I have deleted all information I posted on the forums.

 

[Blaster3500]

LOL, those cats have it good!

Loving your approach to OEM+ look. I am a huge fan of 'sleepers' as these cars are relatively common but most do not rip up the asphalt when the boost kicks in. I used to have goals for OEM+ with my MKIV GTI; there were so many Audi offerings (and R32) that really spruced up the car. It feels like BMW has plenty of those upgrades as well.


Holy shit that video of inside the car. That thing RIPS.

Exhaust sounds fantastic, I do hear the rasp in the first video... but I have similar sounds with my 335is exhaust and catless DPs...



Regarding specifics about the turbos... hmm. I am mostly interested in how the day to day feels with them. I've been bothering Rob with a million emails about impacts on daily driving specifically with how quick boost builds. My 104k+ stock turbos are a little lethargic and I don't know how to compare with any offerings. I don't want to downgrade from current responsiveness.

Is there a way to get a 'feel for responsiveness' through logs? I have a few logs from last weekend, including:

Log-08-27-2020-02-15-40

Uploaded by API.

bmw.spoolstreet.com

I personally am not looking to drag my car, but I have been impressed with the slips you posted. Getting into big turbo territory! What goes through my head is 'what is the day to day like with turbos targeting so much power?'


I get brought back down to earth with my 'instant spool' expectations after reading:




Other than spool speed and feel on day to day, do you have anything else to share? It seems like you document thoroughly!

Haha that is only on 93. On e85 it is a whole different animal. I will upload so videos in the next few weeks. I got the suspension bits installed this weekend and started on getting the exhaust sorted. Once I have the midpipe welded and the car aligned it should be good to go.

To be honest I haven't driven a stock turbo car in so long it would be hard for me to give an honest opinion. I will try to get some comparable logs for you and also some clips of normal driving and responsiveness. On e85 and high power it drives great no issue other than traction if not running the drag radials. Depending on the weather 3rd can get a little sketchy even with the boost lowered in mid range and tapering up top. My biggest complaint about the setup would be the clutch/SMFW. The noises are very annoying and to me it would get old driving everyday. I know lots of people do but that is my opinion.

I don't think you could go wrong either way with the GF's or 2's. It is always nice to have more room to grow as long as you are happy with the spool. What are your power goals?

China now does 19T turbos for about $1200!
I had GCs before. Now with everyone's success of the China 17Ts I've gone for the Wuhan wind mills...

I hope they work out for you. I do not enjoy swapping turbos so felt the extra expense for the GF's was well worth it.

I have RBs GF 17t on my daily driver and it is an absolute blast to drive on full e85 even in this hot South Carolina weather.

I can't wait to see how she pulls in the winter.

Awesome! Where are you located in SC?

RB turbo's look great but would never buy them because of his attitude.

I can relate and understand. I have come to learn over the years that Rob is a straight shooter. It may come across brash or arrogant, but there is generally a reason. I could not imagine being a vendor for this platform.

 

[RNM]

I am staying in Hardeeville, South Carolina for a travel nursing assignment. I will be here until mid October then I will be heading back to Florida.

 

[fmorelli]

RB turbo's look great but would never buy them because of his attitude.

I would actually by RB because of his attitude. Customer service attitude over forum fluff 100x.

Filippo

 

[V8bait]

RB turbo's look great but would never buy them because of his attitude.

I think both Rob and Tony get bad raps because of their antics. Tony probably more albeit also more deserving sometimes with his forum etiquite. In my workings and tunings with Rob and Tony I have always found them to be very professional via email and phone, and baring extenuating circumstances have always seemed to take care of their customers very well. They're both passionate about their work and in many ways have pushed each other to continue to innovate for the platform. I own a set of VTT GC's and wouldn't hesitate to pick up a set of RB GF's either from what I've seen tuning them. To put that in perspective I've also had a set of Pure's and MMP ball-bearing GTX clones. The twins on this platform have come a long way.

 

[screaminfast]

I think both Rob and Tony get bad raps because of their antics. Tony probably more albeit also more deserving sometimes with his forum etiquite. In my workings and tunings with Rob and Tony I have always found them to be very professional via email and phone, and baring extenuating circumstances have always seemed to take care of their customers very well. They're both passionate about their work and in many ways have pushed each other to continue to innovate for the platform. I own a set of VTT GC's and wouldn't hesitate to pick up a set of RB GF's either from what I've seen tuning them. To put that in perspective I've also had a set of Pure's and MMP ball-bearing GTX clones. The twins on this platform have come a long way.

well said

 

[langsbr]

I think both Rob and Tony get bad raps because of their antics. Tony probably more albeit also more deserving sometimes with his forum etiquite. In my workings and tunings with Rob and Tony I have always found them to be very professional via email and phone, and baring extenuating circumstances have always seemed to take care of their customers very well. They're both passionate about their work and in many ways have pushed each other to continue to innovate for the platform. I own a set of VTT GC's and wouldn't hesitate to pick up a set of RB GF's either from what I've seen tuning them. To put that in perspective I've also had a set of Pure's and MMP ball-bearing GTX clones. The twins on this platform have come a long way.

Having is very different than running. Did you run the mmp ball bearing ones? I've yet to see more than one person running them and they weren't very impressive, especially spool. I remember you said you had them in your build thread. Why did you not end up using them?

 

[V8bait]

Having is very different than running. Did you run the mmp ball bearing ones? I've yet to see more than one person running them and they weren't very impressive, especially spool. I remember you said you had them in your build thread. Why did you not end up using them?

Yeah that's complicated but could be summed up as fear, but not just because of the MMP thing. Mauricio always did right by me I felt, I did like his designs just sometimes he'd get a little too into cost cuts. For example, on the OG outlets that he developed when everyone said they were useless, he had the foresight to taper the CNC adapter on the compressor outlet and I thought as an engineer the attention to detail was great, to this day nobody makes adapters that nice for outlets. It's unfortunate some of the choices and the way things went.

Anyway, I had him build them to specific spec for me conservatively unlike most of those less than stellar and overly aggressive examples, I don't want to really get into it but every bb turbo I've been a part of on this platform has failed outside of the VTT S3 (which is imo the ultimate upgrade). I've tuned the NOS attempt, VTT's dabble into bb, and the MMP. After I saw one Ken was tuning literally explode on the dyno I was literally at, I put that project on hold. Ultimately that guy's set was pretty frankenturbo of hodge podge wheel matching and other issues (n54 in an e36) but I had to make a call, and I'm happy with my choice as it's been solid. FWIW they will be used soon on a less daily driven project.

Thanks for reminding me I need to post dynos. The next time you complain about not having "real world" results think of me, build thread a year ago, slaying hellcats, never updated. I know rob has a few GF in the wild at 28-30psi not posting shit too lol. Fml.

 

[b4llistic]

EDIT: Thanks your finding and reading my post. Unfortunately, Spoolstreet is no longer a neutral platform where we can have honest discussions on subjects and products freely.
For this reason I have deleted all information I posted on the forums.

 

[ShocknAwe]

I agree but it's only part of the story. If you do a Google on MMP turbo's, it's usually Rob replying, talking shit and smack without any solid background info on his claims. Basically behaving like a little bitch who got bettered by the competion (at that point in time anyway)
Also in some E-mail conversations we had I was also not impressed.Very arrogant and I got lied to repeatedly about my PCV kit bieng shipped out. It took him weeks. And this all was still in a "good guy new customer" settings. I would never want to get in a warranty claim issue with him so I avoided him and went with MMP, who actually sent me more than what was promised, way better pricing, quick and direct on the E-mail and has a nice clan of MMP drivers to share experiences with.

Any reports/results from any twin turbo guys, regardless of brand, who run 26PSI+ on twins, i ignore. Those guys should get singles

FFS can we keep the vendor vs vendor shit out of product review threads? It's like this every time and makes it hard for folks looking for objective build based data to read through the clap.

Beetlejuice beetlejuice beetlejuice

 

[langsbr]

Thanks for reminding me I need to post dynos. The next time you complain about not having "real world" results think of me, build thread a year ago, slaying hellcats, never updated. I know rob has a few GF in the wild at 28-30psi not posting shit too lol. Fml.

I can't call you out on that, lol. I've never even created a build thread. I figured there is no interest since I am not either "internet famous", have a ginormous single, or have one of the random 'record breaking' setups. I think I have a world record in vehicles with Dickass brakes tho, so there's that! I'm happy with my setup, especially for how its performed. Never dyno'd either , but slaying hellcats myself - a Redeye no less

 

[MoreBoost]

Totally not comparable to the RB GFs in any way other than they both use a 19T compressor wheel. The Turbine housing, manifold, and even compressor housing are all different and the RB GFs are MUCH more optimal for high boost. I would wager that Rob is one of, if not the only vendor that does his own VSR balancing, which the china boi turbos most likely aren't balanced at all.

Yes maybe see results before you just guess with no info

 

[Blaster3500]

Yes maybe see results before you just guess with no info

How is he guessing? Everything stated were facts. The "19ts" are nothing new except using a cheap chinafold instead of machining stock housings. You could buy a similar product YEARS ago. I would he happy to wager that GFs would make much more power in comparison to a China 19t setup with similar mods and same boost and timing levels.

Edit: Lets not derail the thread with another China turbo debate.

 

[ShocknAwe]

How is he guessing? Everything stated were facts. The "19ts" are nothing new except using a cheap chinafold instead of machining stock housings. You could buy a similar product YEARS ago. I would he happy to wager that GFs would make much more power in comparison to a China 19t setup with similar mods and same boost and timing levels.

Edit: Lets not derail the thread with another China turbo debate.

They can't help themselves. Impossible need to endlessly justify why they're ok using cheap parts with little to no QC done.

Thanks again for detailing the GF option for folks.

 

[Blaster3500]

They can't help themselves. Impossible need to endlessly justify why they're ok using cheap parts with little to no QC done.

Thanks again for detailing the GF option for folks.

Of course. In case anyone stumbles across this thread and is looking for pro's and con's between the GF's and China 19ts

GF Pros
-Assembled, balanced to a high standard, and good portion of machining done in the US. Compressor housings come as a blank casting and are machined, exhaust housing's are machined to accept the turbine wheel. The manifolds faces are machined flat and CNC ported. The wastegate flapper parts are completely custom and machined in the US. There is lots of other machining and detail work that goes into these turbos. When I first talked with Rob about these his goal was to make nicest twin setup available with no corners cut.
-Larger A/R Turbine housing
-TD04 Compressor housing
-Billet wastegate parts
-Genuine Wastegate actuators
-Vendor that has years of experience on the platform with a proven track record (Stats disclosed) that you can pick up the phone and call.

GF Cons
-Cost
-Outlet does not work the the stock coolant tank

 

[fmorelli]

Your forgot one of the biggest GF pros
- balanced on a VSR to very high specification by a pro.

I forget the numbers Robs shoots for. Discussed somewhere on line.. But each set of GFs come with a real balance sheet for the turbos you bought, not a xerox copy of some random graph.

Filippo