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I'd say pretty easily, I made somewhere in the 600's with a single 450. It was a E50 mix and the lpfp was struggling. With 2 450's, 700 shouldn't be an issue. Also why 2 450's why not 1 450 and 1 535.
You're on stock sized turbos, right? N54 on stock turbos can hit the 600's for whp? Forgive my ignorance, I'm n55. I knew the stock n54 twins could outflow the stock n55 single, but I didn't realize it was to that extent.
I was on Daw stage 2's at the time, which are 17t's. I think the average N54 stock turbo setup caps out around 450whp, You can squeeze out more not many do.
Haha, okay that makes more sense! 450ish is more what I was thinking of for stock twins.
I was just using the dual 450’s as an example. I have a single 450 going in now for my stock turbos but I’d get another 450 or 535 when the time comes and run a BMP4 controller with possible the POD overdrive.
Should be doable. I was on e55 with this kit and their dual 450 LPFP setup with my 6266 and I made 705 whp at 28psi in 95* heat. It was roughly close to the limit of what could be done with the fuel system.
Mine has been working well for me. No issues as of yet. Had a slight oil leak but that was caused by me. Built motor with a 3582R at 29psi running about e63. Tuned by @carabuser
Had one come back for a rebuild request, upon disassembly found that it was fine. It was the HPFP that pooped out and the shop didn't know the POD is just a gearbox (they sent the HPFP with POD attached).
Hello and Happy New Year to all! I will be going with a POD now and possibly port injection later, can anyone confirm if the fuel rail delivery hose will work with an EOS PI intake manifold? thanks much.
So I just want to ask real quick if this high pressure fuel rail supports higher flow and how much over stock if you have that info? If it supports more than a drilled out stock fuel rail?This has been a long time coming but it's finally here and ready to go. PFS is proud to announce the POD, or Planetary Over Drive.
E9X/E8X HPFP POD
The PFS POD (Planetary Over Drive) is an overspeed gearbox for your N54 high pressure fuel pump. Mechanical fuel pump flow potential is a function of shaft speed -spin it faster, get more fuel flow. The PFS POD allows the user to increase the shaft speed 3x, drastically increasing the output...performancefuelingsolutions.com
What it is:
The PFS POD (Planetary Over Drive) is an overspeed gearbox for your N54/early N55 high pressure fuel pump. Mechanical fuel pump flow potential is a function of shaft speed -spin it faster, get more fuel flow. The PFS POD allows the user to increase the shaft speed 3x, drastically increasing the output capability of a stock N54/early N55 HPFP, and avoid the control issues of implementing Port Injection and/or Methanol Injection on vehicles that are targeting more power than the stock fuel system can supply. Regular price is $1099, intro price is 15% off using coupon code: PFSPODME
View attachment 48932
What is included?
All hardware needed to do a full install, with the exception of any gaskets you may choose to replace (recommended) during the installation (intake manifold, throttle body, and charge pipe gaskets not included). Details like the phenolic gaskets and our convenient brace push this to the top of anyone's list who wants a simple and reliable means to stick with factory DI control on a high powered BMW, all offered in a convenient complete solution.
View attachment 48936
- Rail
- POD
- Phenolic Gaskets for Fuel Rail
- High Pressure Line
- -6 Hose with LPFP sensor Bracket
- Bracket w/bolts & washers
What do you need from the rest of the fueling system?
For supporting mods, we recommend an in-tank LPFP upgrade with at least a Single Shot 274 LPFP for power levels up to approximately 600whp. Above that range, we recommend at least a Double Shot dual 274 (or better). If you're looking for a complete package deal, shoot us an email over at [email protected] and we'll be happy to sort you out and kick some coin off the total.
Power Capacity:
An often missed component on power ratings from fueling components is air fuel ratio targets as well as timing/boost targets. In other words, if you run lean and mean, you're asking less of your fuel system versus someone running dirty rich, even if the dynos look the same. A general ballpark capability is in the vicinity of 700 whp on quality full E85 using commonly utilized turbos (big aftermarket twins or a single turbo kit) and commonly utilized tuning strategies. (26-27psi, 8+* timing, ~12.0 target AF). Below is 663 on a stock motor with some new high flowing VTT turbos.
View attachment 48933
POD being fed by a PFS single shot bucketed LPFP (out of fuel on the low pressure side):
View attachment 48931
Here is the same car with a double shot feeding the pod -no tune changes (or adaptation), just pulled out the single shot LPFP, stuck in the double shot LPFP and ran 'er again:
View attachment 48939
Aggressively Tested:
As one can imagine, the POD wasn't the sort of product one can throw into production the day after inspiration hits. There are quite a few test units out in the wild, the highest mileage one now with 30k+ miles on it. Proven at the race track, proven on the dyno, and also torture tested on the bench for temperature tolerance -we spun these suckers at very high speed for an extended period of time to learn just how it would hold up if you happened to want to spend a few hours in a row at 5k. Gears are C45 high strength steel hardened up to 55HRC for durability. We're pretty sure your N54 won't make it, but the POD will.
What do I need?
Standard tools to swap out a HPFP and work on fuel lines. Any o-rings/gaskets you'd like to change during the install (intake manifold gaskets/etc.), good idea to put permatex on the LPFP sensor threads and cinch it down nice and tight to avoid leaks. Everything else is included.
Do I gotta modify anything?
The only thing we had to tweak for real nice fitment was the plastic O2 sensor bracket that's now in the way of the fuel line going into the HP fuel rail. If you haven't already broken yours, it's easy to clip off the forward clip and bump the whole bracket forward. No tune changes required to use, but minor tune changes are required to maximize the performance capability of the POD -simply have your tuner of choice use the new HPFP tables in MHD.
How much is my HPFP going to like being worked 3x faster than normal?
The stock HPFP gets a bad rap in the N54 community as the whole fuel system can be troublesome -particularly with injectors. None the less, the typical failure modes of the HPFP have little to do with the speed they're spinning. In testing and apart on the bench we haven't seen any degradation in HPFP life, nor have we seen it in other HPFP overspeed solutions (VTT shotgun, etc.). In other words, best to start with a fresh HPFP and stop worrying about it. We do recommend index 12 injectors, but this has nothing to do with the POD and everything to do with the N54 working much better with good injectors.
How does this compare to good 'ole Port Injection?
We like PI as well as DI and regularly use both. To us, it really comes down to goals and end use for the vehicle. Port Injection is tried & true, but can be a little tricky to implement in a way that's as safe as when the DME has complete control of your fuel system. We like DI only in the under 700 range, with a strong preference for DI only in the 600 range and below. The POD is easy to install, doesn't require a different box, and lets the DME keep everything in line without going through injectors like you're changing socks. Above the 700 mark injector finickiness seems to start outweighing the DI benefits, and PI pulls ahead due to the ease of pushing in large amounts of fuel.
Have Installation Instructions?
We have an electronic format guide with some basic tips to help the install go smoothly. If you can walnut blast or change out a HPFP, you can install the POD.
Package Pricing?
As mentioned above, YES. From a simple POD & Single Shot ready to run kit to Double Shots with external FPR's, we're here to support you. Simply email [email protected] and we'll be glad to help you piece together a complete package.
Chris
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I'm a bit confused about all the discussions around LPFP capability with POD. Some seems to be successful with Walbro 535 with E85 only and others struggle...
I would like to confirm if I would be OK with the below setup targeting 100% E85 max 600hp (crank), DI only. Car is Z4 E89 35i.
- Single Walbro 535 + new filter/regulator assembly. In original bucket as the car is used for track days.
- All fuel lines upgraded to AN6 with fuel filter (integrated check valve). HPFP internal filter removed.
- PFS POD
- Index 12 injectors
- Stage 2 twins will be maxed out 600hp (crank) with 100% E85
I was planning for flex fuel too, but if the setup is not 100% E85 600hp (crank) capable it does not make sense at least for me. I currently have Walbro 450 with E45 (50:50 98/E85) and this is maxing out HPFP (rail pressure dropping to ~1000psi with about 25psi boost and 550-575hp on crack). I could just continue with Emix in this case (with better performance provided by PFS POD) and save the money for other stuff. This is the fuel lines with filter and flex fuel, I will do the 535 upgrade anyway as all bits purchased. Just to note that I also have retrofitted LPF sensor to my Z4 so I can monitor LPFP pressure.
One reference that I found - Walbro proposing 548hp 1-2bar boosted with 100% E85. So that suggest I'm not OK for 100% E85...
walbrofuelpumps.com
However PFS is saying in their site that Walbro 450 should be OK up to 600whp, I guess that is with pump gas:
"For supporting mods, we recommend an in-tank LPFP upgrade with at least a Single Shot 274 LPFP for power levels up to approximately 600whp. Above that range, we recommend a Double Shot dual 274 (or better)."
I would like to confirm if I would be OK with the below setup targeting 100% E85 max 600hp (crank), DI only. Car is Z4 E89 35i.
- Single Walbro 535 + new filter/regulator assembly. In original bucket as the car is used for track days.
- All fuel lines upgraded to AN6 with fuel filter (integrated check valve). HPFP internal filter removed.
- PFS POD
- Index 12 injectors
- Stage 2 twins will be maxed out 600hp (crank) with 100% E85
I was planning for flex fuel too, but if the setup is not 100% E85 600hp (crank) capable it does not make sense at least for me. I currently have Walbro 450 with E45 (50:50 98/E85) and this is maxing out HPFP (rail pressure dropping to ~1000psi with about 25psi boost and 550-575hp on crack). I could just continue with Emix in this case (with better performance provided by PFS POD) and save the money for other stuff. This is the fuel lines with filter and flex fuel, I will do the 535 upgrade anyway as all bits purchased. Just to note that I also have retrofitted LPF sensor to my Z4 so I can monitor LPFP pressure.
One reference that I found - Walbro proposing 548hp 1-2bar boosted with 100% E85. So that suggest I'm not OK for 100% E85...
Walbro 535LPH F90000295 Fuel Pump - (Universal E85 Ethanol) Ultra High-Performance - TI Automotive
Walbro 535LPH - TI Automotive TCD495 Fuel PumpHighest flow in-tank brushed fuel pump from TI AutomotiveWalbro Part Number: F90000295 Hellcat Plus + Install Kit 400-1168Horsepower: 985HP+ at 60PSI, naturally aspirated applicationsHorsepower: 900HP+ at 90PSI, naturally aspirated applicationsFlow...
walbrofuelpumps.com
However PFS is saying in their site that Walbro 450 should be OK up to 600whp, I guess that is with pump gas:
"For supporting mods, we recommend an in-tank LPFP upgrade with at least a Single Shot 274 LPFP for power levels up to approximately 600whp. Above that range, we recommend a Double Shot dual 274 (or better)."
This was with bucketed 450 and and E50 mix, right? So in that sense the added flow capacity of the 535 over the 450 (25-30% more) + 100% E85 should work I guess...
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