WhyAnN20 Introduction Post

[WhyAnN20]

Hi

A few lines to present myself here.

For some reason I went from the path of asking for a specific tune for my BMW F20 125i (B20N20A 218 hp engine) not knowing much about it, engines and regulation system … to … building a full built engine starting from a brand new one and having it specifically tuned and wanting to understand in depth how it works and how it should be tuned.
First step will be to reach about 350-370 hp, 450 Nm …
Second step : with further turbo upgrade to reach 420-450 Hp, 500-550 Nm, just to reach AMG Class A power level and match somewhat M2CS specification.

Details of the project : (currently on going, new engine received, disassembled and parts ordered, partially received)
- closed decking (HCR)
- sleeving with LA sleeve performance dry sleeves (identical to S55 sleeves)
- CP pistons and rods
- ACL rod bearing
- King main bearings
- ARP main studs
- ARP head studs
- stage 2 Turbo by HP turbo (63.4 mm MFS compressor, larger 9 blades turbine)
- Turbosmart upgraded Diverter Valve
- Wagner Tuning Evo Intercooler
- Wagner Tuning High Catted Downpipe
- S63 injectors
- B58TU HPFP
- Reinforced Sachs clutch
- Baffled oil pan
- Custom tune (need to choose a tuner …)

Chassis will get its upgraded setup too beyond the current Brembo performance pads, stainless steel brake lines, power flex bushes with to come upgraded brakes, reviewed anti roll bars, probably B14 Bilstein coilovers, M3/M4 LCA and tension struts, KC design lower bars, 513M wheels to support 255 front /275 back tires …

Overall objective is having fun banging my head at the project, understanding as much as possible about my car and my engine, and make it a daily track capable car somewhat close to an M2 CS …

 

[SlowE93]

Welcome !
Any pics of this project ?

 

[WhyAnN20]

Welcome !

Any pics of this project ? As you can see, old engine removed, brand new block disassembled and ready for shipment as soon as I get the pistons, rods, sleeves and bushings for closed decking and sleeving …

 

[wheela]

Welcome, nice build!!

 

[WhyAnN20]

If a slow build results in a fast car then I am probably on my way to some world record … parts here below : pistons, rods, LA sleeves, rod bearings, studs, MILVS, B58TU HPFP, Precision Raceworks with Walbro 450 LPFP , stage 2 hybrid turbo and baffled (to be welded) oil pan …

 

[WhyAnN20]

If a slow build results in a fast car then I am probably on my way to some world record … parts here below : pistons, rods, LA sleeves, rod bearings, studs, MILVS, B58TU HPFP, Precision Raceworks with Walbro 450 LPFP , stage 2 hybrid turbo and baffled (to be welded) oil pan …

 

[pbondar]

Respect…I tweaked my N20 powered Z4 E89..however my ambitions were more modest..I did fit the uprated Mitsubishi turbo and raised it from 185 BHP on a Uk dyno measured at the crank to 305bhp and 450nm..having a ZF8HP box rated at 450nm with no s/w available to uprate it I stuck at that point..will be interesting to see how it goes..

 

[WhyAnN20]

Respect…I tweaked my N20 powered Z4 E89..however my ambitions were more modest..I did fit the uprated Mitsubishi turbo and raised it from 185 BHP on a Uk dyno measured at the crank to 305bhp and 450nm..having a ZF8HP box rated at 450nm with no s/w available to uprate it I stuck at that point..will be interesting to see how it goes..

Thinking about the engine set up and buying parts is the easy part of the job. Now it is time to send the engine block for close decking and sleeves install, the real business starts here . And I am looking for the right tuner - I believe this is the trickiest part of the process - since between the closed decking, the sleeves, and the pistons, knock tables adjustments will be required and obviously with the stage 2 turbo, a proper tune will be mandatory … I am still hesitating at adapting an N55 (an M2 one or better a TTE hybrid one) turbo from day one to go directly to my final set up goal … long message to say I appreciate the respects message and feel it may be premature . If you know a tuner that would handle this set up the right way … feel free to message me !
Pretty sure a 305 hp N20 Z4 is a lot ot fun to drive …

 

[pbondar]

Thinking about the engine set up and buying parts is the easy part of the job. Now it is time to send the engine block for close decking and sleeves install, the real business starts here . And I am looking for the right tuner - I believe this is the trickiest part of the process - since between the closed decking, the sleeves, and the pistons, knock tables adjustments will be required and obviously with the stage 2 turbo, a proper tune will be mandatory … I am still hesitating at adapting an N55 (an M2 one or better a TTE hybrid one) turbo from day one to go directly to my final set up goal … long message to say I appreciate the respects message and feel it may be premature . If you know a tuner that would handle this set up the right way … feel free to message me !
Pretty sure a 305 hp N20 Z4 is a lot ot fun to drive …

Part of my decision to move on from the N20 to the N54 was the absence of N20 parts, technical support and tuners ..plus all the doom warnings on the fragility of the N20…

Ironically the N20 E90 Auto was a really really sweet car…300+bhp 450 nm was more than enough to go as fast as you could possibly go on Scottish roads..plus much much better handling than the same chassis with that massive N54 with so much of it past the front axle…heh ho hindsight is a wonderful thing…

As the UK band “swing out sister “ said…it’s better to travel than….

 

[isabellawayne]

Hi

A few lines to present myself here.

For some reason I went from the path of asking for a specific tune for my BMW F20 125i (B20N20A 218 hp engine) not knowing much about it, engines and regulation system … to … building a full built engine starting from a brand new one and having it specifically tuned and wanting to understand in depth how it works and how it should be tuned.
First step will be to reach about 350-370 hp, 450 Nm …
Second step : with further turbo upgrade to reach 420-450 Hp, 500-550 Nm, just to reach AMG Class A power level and match somewhat M2CS specification.

Details of the project : (currently on going, new engine received, disassembled and parts ordered, partially received)
- closed decking (HCR)
- sleeving with LA sleeve performance dry sleeves (identical to S55 sleeves)
- CP pistons and rods
- ACL rod bearing
- King main bearings
- ARP main studs
- ARP head studs
- stage 2 Turbo by HP turbo (63.4 mm MFS compressor, larger 9 blades turbine)
- Turbosmart upgraded Diverter Valve
- Wagner Tuning Evo Intercooler
- Wagner Tuning High Catted Downpipe
- S63 injectors
- B58TU HPFP
- Reinforced Sachs clutch
- Baffled oil pan
- Custom tune (need to choose a tuner …)
Your opinion is interesting. I slightly agree with you here. In general, if I don’t agree with something, then I ask https://studyhelper.com/argumentative-essay-samples to help me. It’s easier for me, because to be honest I’m a little lazy in this regard. I don’t know what to do with this, I can’t bring myself to do it.
Chassis will get its upgraded setup too beyond the current Brembo performance pads, stainless steel brake lines, power flex bushes with to come upgraded brakes, reviewed anti roll bars, probably B14 Bilstein coilovers, M3/M4 LCA and tension struts, KC design lower bars, 513M wheels to support 255 front /275 back tires …

Overall objective is having fun banging my head at the project, understanding as much as possible about my car and my engine, and make it a daily track capable car somewhat close to an M2 CS …

need pics

 

[WhyAnN20]

need pics

Pics available below in the thread

 

[sqwin_n20]

Randomly I came into spool street looking for other things. Sounds like you are copying my build...it's definitely fun and surprises other people on a daily basis if im provoked. Note I am stock motor + stock block, spec single steel mass flywheel + stage 3+ clutch as it drives like stock but if you need it to grab and go, it will grab and go.

The issue with todays hybrid turbo options for the n20 is you can only physically move so much air through a td04-06 turbo. most hybrid upgrades get this up to a td04-19t, but at the same time due to the factory manifold being limited to .41 ar, you are stuck.

Realistically you are looking around 370-380 whp and ~450 torque due to not having to worry about torque limits.

This was done over a year ago, not to derail your thread. only at 23 psi however and without the miles. Please note todays changes I retrofitted the b58 coils + installed the milvs + full 3" exhaust + custom 4" -> 3" downpipe (hacked up a downpipe from IPOS for the b46 [turbo flange change, shortened it, relocated lower o2 sensor position to not hit the transmission]).. With the Milvs we saw a 5whp gain at peak however the entire power band was drastically improved + power extends to 6600 rpm vs falling at 6100. I have pegged out 5th gear in the MT at 7200 to hit fuel cut aka 170mph with room to grow in 6th gear as an experiment.

Please note, with this current turbo setup you are right at the limit of the b58tu pump + stock lpfp as it runs out of fuel around 400whp for full e85. thus you run a e60 blend OR swap over to a b58 fx200 (it fits no issues).

Suspension wise I would recommend you utilize the factory arms but have the monoball upgrade + thrust bearing upgrade. camber plates will be what you want to do for camber expecially if you are planning on running b14s. Feal coilovers is something you'll want to look at.

I do spin and lose traction going a 1-2-3 pull on indy 500s 275/40/18. diffsonline will be of necessity to have a wave track LSD put into the diff to not spin between shifts.

GLWB, cheers !

 

[WhyAnN20]

Randomly I came into spool street looking for other things. Sounds like you are copying my build...it's definitely fun and surprises other people on a daily basis if im provoked. Note I am stock motor + stock block, spec single steel mass flywheel + stage 3+ clutch as it drives like stock but if you need it to grab and go, it will grab and go.

The issue with todays hybrid turbo options for the n20 is you can only physically move so much air through a td04-06 turbo. most hybrid upgrades get this up to a td04-19t, but at the same time due to the factory manifold being limited to .41 ar, you are stuck.

Realistically you are looking around 370-380 whp and ~450 torque due to not having to worry about torque limits.

This was done over a year ago, not to derail your thread. only at 23 psi however and without the miles. Please note todays changes I retrofitted the b58 coils + installed the miles + full 3" exhaust + custom 4" -> 3" downpipe (hacked up a downpipe from IPOS for the b46 [turbo flange change, shortened it, relocated lower o2 sensor position to not hit the transmission]).. With the Milvs we saw a 5whp gain at peak however the entire power band was drastically improved + power extends to 6600 rpm vs falling at 6100. I have pegged out 5th gear in the MT at 7200 to hit fuel cut aka 170mph with room to grow in 6th gear as an experiment.

Please note, with this current turbo setup you are right at the limit of the b58tu pump + stock lpfp as it runs out of fuel around 400whp for full e85. thus you run a e60 blend OR swap over to a b58 fx200 (it fits no issues).

Suspension wise I would recommend you utilize the factory arms but have the monorail upgrade + thrust bearing upgrade. camber plates will be what you want to do for camber expecially if you are planning on running b14s. Feal coilovers is something you'll want to look at.

GLWB, cheers !

Hey thx a lot for the feedback ! I have definitely been more than inspired by your build and should have quoted you . I totally agree with the point about the 0.41 ar turbo limitation hence I am still hesitating at going the extra step right now with an N55 derived turbo (you may recognize here some Harry Windberg inspired set up and his wiki is more than inspiring…). I indeed decided to go with reinforced internals including the closed decking starting from a brand new engine for the peace of mind - which however means there is the need to properly customize the knock tables (so I guess I did trade one headache for another ).
Interestingly enough I was reading this morning (europe time ) again about the post “Ignition Coil Secondary Spark Energy Comparison (N54/N55, B58 and PR)” …
Happy to see you here, I feel spoolstreet is definitely a place where people really interested in technical stuff are more than welcome, even if they are total beginners like I am but willing to understand things in depth …
Thx a lot for the hints about the chassis too, I ll have a look at this too (plenty of time before I get the car back on the road …).
Cheers

 

[wheela]

Randomly I came into spool street looking for other things. Sounds like you are copying my build...it's definitely fun and surprises other people on a daily basis if im provoked. Note I am stock motor + stock block, spec single steel mass flywheel + stage 3+ clutch as it drives like stock but if you need it to grab and go, it will grab and go.

The issue with todays hybrid turbo options for the n20 is you can only physically move so much air through a td04-06 turbo. most hybrid upgrades get this up to a td04-19t, but at the same time due to the factory manifold being limited to .41 ar, you are stuck.

Realistically you are looking around 370-380 whp and ~450 torque due to not having to worry about torque limits.

This was done over a year ago, not to derail your thread. only at 23 psi however and without the miles. Please note todays changes I retrofitted the b58 coils + installed the milvs + full 3" exhaust + custom 4" -> 3" downpipe (hacked up a downpipe from IPOS for the b46 [turbo flange change, shortened it, relocated lower o2 sensor position to not hit the transmission]).. With the Milvs we saw a 5whp gain at peak however the entire power band was drastically improved + power extends to 6600 rpm vs falling at 6100. I have pegged out 5th gear in the MT at 7200 to hit fuel cut aka 170mph with room to grow in 6th gear as an experiment.

Please note, with this current turbo setup you are right at the limit of the b58tu pump + stock lpfp as it runs out of fuel around 400whp for full e85. thus you run a e60 blend OR swap over to a b58 fx200 (it fits no issues).

Suspension wise I would recommend you utilize the factory arms but have the monoball upgrade + thrust bearing upgrade. camber plates will be what you want to do for camber expecially if you are planning on running b14s. Feal coilovers is something you'll want to look at.

I do spin and lose traction going a 1-2-3 pull on indy 500s 275/40/18. diffsonline will be of necessity to have a wave track LSD put into the diff to not spin between shifts.

GLWB, cheers !

Welcome to spoolstreet!