Fairly simple question. Is it possible/practical to do a triple barrel shotgun setup? I'm assuming the injectors are the limiting factor, not running out of HPFP on the double barrel setup.
Curious if triple barrel shotgun possible?
- Thread starter Reaper0995
- Start date
Readin Tonys post has made me curious about combustion pressures at high HP levels with DI..i dont know if you need to calculate cylinder pressure and increase HP to compensate
We may need to do more software magic in the DME to keep the injectors open longer if that isn't possible already. I have heard that the injectors fail even with the current double shotgun method when rail pressures are too high, I'd think it is possible, technically, but there are some things that would need worked out I think. Someone would have to confirm the reason for injector failure if any, but it would make sense that if you put too much pressure they would start to have problems.
Tony has posted inn the other thread that you can have a triple(physically) and they’ve done it by removing the airconditioning... because racecar
I literally had no idea you posted this when I posted my photo. We did this a long time ago. Coming up on two years. Its possible, at that point, the stock rail is a restriction, and honestly, the stock injectors prob would not like it. They already get moody at 800+WHP. With a large billet rail, some upgraded injectors, and full control of the injector tables, 1000WHP DI only would not be difficult. The fuel supply would be there.
You're thinking of a diesel that has to overcome cyl pressure. These inject either during or right after intake stroke.
Obviously a billet rail wouldn’t be difficult, but what about the injector oart of things? I know it a piezo injector so that complicates things, but what’s stopping someone from creating better ones? Is it just funding and the fact that the n5x community is so small or are there actual physical hurdles that need surpassed? I’ve seen jake y say injection tables are not an issue. I’d love to be able to utilize di when i decide to go built motor and shoot for the stars
Manfactures as large as Delphi does not even want to manufacture Piezo injectors due to the enormous cost. No one is the aftermarket will most likely be able to do anything to fix these. Why they start acting up at a certain level I am not sure. Elevated Cylinder pressure is my main guess.
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That set up was running on a car 2 years ago. It works well. We have been so far ahead of the game it's really frustrating to see people catching up in the horsepower race. We literally had a closed deck built motor with 1200HP capable turbos on it again about 2 years ago. The motor turned out to be a disaster. We had to regroup, then started running the GC's for testing. We finally got stage 3 back on the car in Oct, made 870WHP, and immediately ran into issues. The car seems to be running well again, we should be able to get it dialed in soon.
what issues did you run into with the injectors? I remember seeing you mention something about the car being rich? would you be 100% sure it wasn't quick spike of lean mixture then the DME dumping fuel to compensate?
Possibly at the power level that high, may need to start using injection timing tables to really get into the nitty gritty things. The injector limit hasn't been met yet at least in theory due to the fact we haven't exhaust increasing the injection time yet.
We did this back in like 08 maybe 09 or 10 on the DISI's when we thought we reached injector limits but we didn't. a millisecond or two extra injection time bumps fuel pretty good if the flow is there behind the injectors. just a thought.
This is the sort of stuff that makes me want to build a full blown race car afterall.
Could one of the injector issues be caused by the sudden fuel rail pressure drops? I know there are a few platforms that really embrace the fuel rail dampers, but obviously those are conventional port injection setups. Not sure if it would be possible to make one for a direct injection system, but might be an interesting thought to put on the table.
http://www.radiumauto.com/Fuel-Pulse-Damper-Direct-Mount-Kits-P759.aspx
http://www.radiumauto.com/Fuel-Pulse-Damper-Direct-Mount-Kits-P759.aspx
We do not have drops in rail pressure, so that is not it. The issues with the car were not solely injectors, we had to change some stuff chasing the issue. We nailed it down looks like, and plan to start tuning again this weekend. The injector issue is, for now, when boost comes on, one injector can not regulate fuel properly, not sure how or why, and that bank just goes dead rich. If you have experience with these cars. N54's do not mind running lean, they will lose a little power, but generally will not misfire even when dead lean. On the other hand, as soon as they go rich they misfire almost instantly.
